A Friday Night at L and H Clubs

[shipitfish]

On Friday, I played at a few clubs in NYC. Originally, I was supposed to attend a home game in Queens, but the host never returned my email or phone calls. I decided to go to the L Club, which was reopening after the busts, and head to the H Club afterwards.

I'll say more in a full review, but I am usually not a fan of the L Club. However, there are few clubs left around NYC, so I will have to put up with it.

I spent about two hours at the L club. I was glad that the staff was was a bit better than usual. They had two $1/$2 NL HE games running, and a small tournament. I played $1/$2 at a table that drifted between tight-weak and loose-passive.

I made most of my profit for the night on one hand at the L club. A fellow holding what I clearly read to be a "reasonable pair" 88-JJ raised to only $6 preflop, and I called $4 from the BB with 46s, after the small blind also called. I like taking flops with this kind of hand, particularly against players who likely will overplay one pair, and even more so when the flop comes 462 rainbow. The SB, holding what I think was A6, bet out too much, around $30. I immediately made it $100 to go. I'd been running over the table 15-20 minutes before when they were playing tight-weak. I knew the pair-holder behind me was glad to finally have a "hand" against me. He immediately under-raised for his whole $101 stack with 99. While I did have to explain to the dealer that not all board pairs counterfeit flopped two pair (the river came a 4, and she start shipping to 9s and 4s), I won a substantial pot. My opponent walked out in disgust; they always do when you take their stack with 64s. When will they learn about implied odds, and how to give up on one pair when it is clearly beat? Hopefully never.

I eventually moved onto the H Club, which I hadn't been to since its recent relocation. After some minor difficult getting into the club, I found they had the same nice setup as before, although the smoking room — like it is in so many clubs now — is far too close to the table. I played another coupled of hours there and lost a mere $6.

I played two hands poorly, one at the L and the other at the H. At the L club, when our table was full and still a bit tight weak, I held AKo and made it $10 to go after a couple of people limped. I got one caller and saw the flop heads up with position with $28 in the pot and lots behind. We checked through a rainbow flop of JT8 and when the J turned, he quickly checked again. I bet out $30 after thinking for a moment. I felt that he would have bet a J or T on the turn (or perhaps the flop), and didn't think he had much of a hand. This player was pretty tight and was unlikely to call. I was surprised when he check-raised. I actually think he had a hand that he inappropriately slow-played. I think, for example, that he may have had JT, Q9, or AJ on the flop, and then checked again to induce a bet from me, an aggressive player.

However, it was really stupid to bet out there, because I'm not representing a hand that makes sense. I don't think he outplayed me, but he may have, and it was a good spot to do it. If I am going to bluff in that hand, it has to be on the flop for half the pot.

At the H Club, I won a pot with A A that I could have easily lost. I reraised a min-raise of $4 preflop to $12, and got two callers behind me, as well as the original raiser. Behind me, one player was a very loose, and usually passive (but capable of making plays when holding flush draws, which he loved). The other, on the button, was a young "grinder" type who thought he was better than he was. However, I didn't have the kid figured out completely yet. The min-raiser, to my immediate right, was a tight-aggressive player who knew a bit about the game. The two behind me had stacks of about $300 or so; I and the min-raiser had about $500.

I got worried about the KJ8 rainbow flop, and I bet a mere $35 into the $52 pot and was called by the two behind me, and the min-raiser folded. I realized immediately after that I probably should have bet more. I was making it a bit too cheap for their likely straight draws. OTOH, I was hoping to avoid getting to involved in a big pot. I doubt they would raise without at least two pair, so I wanted to muck the aces if they raised. Without a flush draw on board, I didn't expect a raise behind me from a draw.

The turn fell 2, putting two clubs on the board. I decided I had the best but vulnerable hand I decided to take the pot with $100 bet into the $157 pot. It did as expected, but I still think somehow that I should have played stronger on the flop to avoid giving the straight draws an easy call.

At the H club, I meet two friendly players named Jeff and Ryan. Jeff seems to be a bit of insider on the NYC poker scene, and was able to tell me that the O Club has reopened, and that another club (the T Club) has also opened. I've got some visits and reviews to do.

I took some pictures of my stacks at the clubs.

Comments

[patty-bush.livejournal.com]

I think you may have gotten away with a larger bet on the flop. As a known aggressive table they could have easily put you on a hand like AQo and figured your flop bet was a continuation bet/bluff and would call you with anything. A larger bet may have made you more money, but as you said it would have swelled the pot, and also it may have only gotten one or two callers.

With the AKo hand, do you really think it was a bad play? CBetting on the flop every time is good and bad, when you hit the board strongly, people will call you thinking it's a bluff, and will give you more sometimes on the turn, but also I've done things like hit with TPTK or held an over pair to the board and have gotten a strong reraise and had to make a tough decision. Were they just check-raising me b/c they've seen me CB a million times before, or do they have two pair or better? Besides, you may have been check raised on the flop with that hand too, maybe he was mixing up his game that hand making a loose preflop draw and got lucky.

[patty-bush.livejournal.com]

the first comment was RE: the AA hand, sorry they're out of order...

[shipitfish.livejournal.com]

I don't usually shoot to make more money with AA in a field of four with a flop like that. I want to make the bet on the flop that wins right there. Seeing a turn out of position with AA on that kind of board can easily get you into a complex situation. The reason to bet more is to charge the draws more and see the turn heads up instead of multiway, not necessarily to make more money.

On the AK hand, the problem with the turn bet is that it doesn't make sense, precisely because I didn't bet the flop. By betting the turn, I am basically screaming at that point that I have an AK or AQ and that I'm making a play because the other guy showed weakness. That's a great spot to be in when I do have top full or somesuch, but with AK, I was better off seeing if the gutshot got there and trapped a slow-played Jack.

[patty-bush.livejournal.com]

good points.

[swolfe.livejournal.com]

$12 is a pretty standard raise for a 1/2 live game even without the minraise. i probably would have made it $20 to go.

[shipitfish.livejournal.com]

In most $1/$2 games, I agree. This game was reasonably tight-weak pre-flop, and I actually expected folds behind me. My goal at the time was to make it look like feeler raise, because I actually thought the min-raiser was trying to induce a reraise with KK, QQ, JJ, or AK. It didn't work out that way, and I agree in most spots clearing the field strongly even if it wins right there is a good play. In this game, I more or less though I'd end up heads up with the min-raiser. Even $10 preflop raises were being viewed as "too much" in this game. (I had stolen the blinds four times with $10 raises already that night.)